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Phil Miglioratti interviewed MaryKate Morse, author of Making Room for
Leadership: Power, Space and Influence
Phil ~ What does the subtitle of your book tell
us about your perspective on leadership?
MaryKate ~ Christians often see leadership as a package of character traits and
leadership skills. You develop your character in Christ, and then you vision
cast, teach-preach, strategize, evangelize, build and lead teams, etc.
However, leadership is more than being a good person and doing right things.
Leadership is a social and a physical. It is social because others give you the
power to influence them. It is physical because the group makes that decision
after instinctively assessing their physical experience of you in their social
space. The group then either invites you into power or closes you out. You can
have the character and the skills but without the group giving you power, you
are taking them nowhere.
And this can be tragic, because they will let you get things done for them, but
they probably won't give you access to their beings for deep formation in Christ
nor will they allow you to change much of their social system. I think this is
the frustration that many pastors and lay leaders feel. They are good people,
trying hard to lead, but nothing happens. On the other hand are leaders who take
up so much space in a room that there is little left for others who want to be
involved. Either way leadership is much more than character and skills.
Phil ~ We have all read/heard discussion about
the role of power in leadership but what might we need to see differently about
how this core competency??
MaryKate ~Without power there is no leadership. As Christians we think power is
a bad thing, and we should avoid it. However, power is given by God to do God's
kingdom work. Therefore, a primary leadership competency is using power well for
the sake of others. This is true servant leadership – accepting power and using
it like Christ to serve others.
Phil ~ Space? What role does the physicality of
the leader play in using that power for God's good? And ... what are some
practical applications, especially in congregational life?
MaryKate ~ Two things – first, our bodies tell the story of our power. If we
walk into a room of strangers, these strangers have a visceral experience of who
we are. This is referred to as presence. The group experiences us as belonging
or not and as strong or not. Then secondly, the group instinctively decides in a
short period of time whether they will pay attention to you or ignore you. They
might be nice, but that's not the same as allowing you a voice in the group.
My book gives several practical applications, and I'll give a couple here, one
that focuses on the individual and one on the group.
- For the individual: Become a "high social interactor." Not an extrovert.
Sometimes extroverts can be self-absorbed. Become an individual who moves
towards others first, engages them, looks them in the eye (in western
culture), and asks questions to get to authentically know them. This is a
learned skill, so anyone can be a high social interactor. Observe and mimic
those who do this well. Leighton Ford, Brian McLaren, Parker Palmer are all
examples of introverts who are skilled high social interactors.
- For the group: Take responsibility for your leaders. If your leader is
misusing power, it is the group's responsibility to hold them accountable.
The group gave them that power (unless, of course, you are in dictatorship).
We make power an individual responsibility and it is a social one. In the
book I write about ways the misuse of power can be observed and then
addressed.
Phil ~ The church growth movement has pastors
and church members using increase (more people, bigger buildings, increased
budgets) as the sole measurement of success ...
Agree or disagree?
Influence should also be a mark of healthy leadership both on an individual
level and a congregational level.
MaryKate ~ Today we are fairly agreed conceptually that more does not mean
better. That doesn't mean we behave as if it were true. However, the outcome of
responding to the gospel is becoming more like Christ. If we are not becoming
Christ-like as individuals and as groups, then we are off track no matter which
measurement of success we are using.
Influence is the power to affect outcomes. Since God created us to have purpose
and care for others and the world, we are all to exercise influence. Whether you
are a parent, a teacher, business person, mission leader, or student, each day
you will affect the outcome of something or someone. The amount of influence
depends on how much power you have and are given.
And yes, you can develop your influence factor, but you can't predict your
influence impact. Impact depends on a combination of God's anointing-timing and
a group's response to you. In the book I describe ways to assess your impact and
then how to steward it. If you have little, it is your responsibility to come
out of the shadows and get involved. If you have a lot, it is your
responsibility to avoid being the sponge soaking up status and influence, but
instead being the one who invites others into influence.
Phil ~ How can a leader use influence to change
the culture of their congregation?
MaryKate ~
- First a leader needs to be accurately aware of how much power he or she
carries into a room. Many leaders over or underestimate the physicality of
their influence. Awareness
- Second a leader takes responsibility to reflect on and manage his or her
power. In prayer, with Christ, humbled before God, each small encounter is
considered. It is the small experiences that shape everyone's reality, not
the big events or big sermons. Self-Stewardship
- Third, a leader helps other leaders to become aware of and improve their
power resources. The use of power is observed best in meetings and daily
social encounters. Reproduction
Our sense of significance comes out of our sense of power. Otherwise, we fight
or hide. A culture cannot be changed if persons are threatened or anxious. If
this competency is addressed, I believe that the congregation will have the
energy and openness for change.
Phil ~ Many of the leaders who will read this
interview serve citywide collaborations. How can influence be maximized to
effect a community-wide impact for the gospel?
MaryKate ~ Christianity has a bad reputation precisely because we use power to
consume. We want to bring others into a particular kind of kingdom defined more
by us than by Christ. It's often about our glory, our agenda and our assurances,
and not Christ's presence, though generally this is an unintentional outcome. I
think leaders are trying to do the right thing. But whenever, a leader feels
aggressive, angry, passive, or anxious, the temptation is to use power to
consume space for his or her purposes. Therefore, we are often seen as bullies
in a sandbox rather than hosts at a generous banquet. Using power for
hospitality creates a spirit of grace. Once grace is experienced collaboration
is natural.
Phil ~ Apply the principles of influence for a
leader who convenes other leaders. In other words, help us think differently
about the form and function of our meetings.
MaryKate ~ Meetings are more important that preaching for influencing a group
for healthy sustained change. Look at how much time Jesus spent with his
disciples in small social settings. Meetings are the very center of
transformational experiences, and we treat them like unimportant, boring
necessities. In meetings we get up close and personal with each other. I see you
and you see me. We have to work together. In meetings we learn about authentic
servant leadership and the art of managing our bodies for God's glory. We learn
about ourselves and each other so we can sharpen and focus our kingdom work.
Meetings are not about crossing off agenda items, but about having a laboratory
to lead more like Christ.
That means time is always taken in meetings to do the relational, emotional, and
spiritual work. Power is talked about and examined and we are held accountable
for its use. When bumps occur because of disagreements, broken humanity
colliding with broken humanity, instead of dismissing or avoiding them, we take
time to unpack and pray for insight and growth as a group and as individuals.
Phil ~ MaryKate, please write a prayer for the
person who is ready to more fully understand the potential of their God-given,
Spirit-empowering influence for the advancement of Christ's kingdom...
MaryKate ~ Creator God, fill my body with your
power and your purpose.
Jesus Christ, give me courage and humility to
invite others to your table.
Holy Spirit, make room in me for the fullness
of Christ and protect me from evil for the sake of your glory and your kingdom.
Amen.